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Author Topic: Where is the “prehistory”?  (Read 2064 times)
Jacques Cinq-Mars
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« on: January 12, 2005, 03:32:13 PM »

All,

Here is, for your information, another grand, mtDNA-based scenario that I find very difficult to reconcile with what I think I know of the prehistoric record of the northern circum-Mediterranean area during the LGM and the Late Glacial.  So much for interdisciplinarity!

Reference to the paper under discussion can be found at the end of this release.

Jacques Cinq-Mars
Quote
Iberia was the European demographic reservoir during the last Ice Age

For further information, please contact:

Catarina Amorim
catarina.amorim@linacre.ox.ac.uk

Posted By:
Observatório da Ciência e do Ensino Superior
12 January 2005


By studying mitochondrial DNA, which is passed from mother to child, researchers have found that most of the actual European inhabitants seem to have come from re-expansion of hunter-gatherers populations, which have migrated from Iberia, Europe after the end of the last Ice Age reports an article in the January issue of Genome Research.

In the study of human evolution through history and pre-history there are now two indispensable sets of genes to follow: Y-chromosome and mitochondrial DNA (mtDNA) genes. Both sets are transmitted uniparentally from one generation to the next - father to son in the case of the Y-chromosome and mother to child in the case of mtDNA - which makes them especially useful to trace lineages.

Mitochondrial DNA is a circular structure composed of 13 genes and exists, as the name indicates, in mitochondria, which are organelles responsible for energy production in the cell. Mitochondrial DNA sequences can be divided in different groups – haplogroups – according to genetic variations (or polymorphisms). Each haplogroup can then be divided into sub-clades (or sub-groups) according to further polymorphisms. Because it is possible to calculate the changes occurring in mtDNA in a certain period of time (the rate of change is constant and known) it is possible to follow in time the different sub-clades and learn when they did get separated, and consequently their individual migrations/geographical separations.

And in fact, the study of mtDNA haplogroups has been used to understand better the migrations of human population throughout evolution. Unfortunately, this has not been possible in Europe, although some progress has been made on a relatively rare haplogroup V. But around half of the European mtDNA sequences belong to a haplogroup (H) and so far it had been impossible to understand its evolutionary pathway in the continent.

But now Luísa Pereira, Martin Richards, Ana Goios, Vincent Macaulay, António Amorim and colleagues from Spain, Israel, Russia, Germany, Dubai, Czech Republic and Ireland, taking advantage of recently available information on haplogroup H polymorphisms, decided to make a new attempt to understand the European migrations throughout evolution. The team of scientists analysed 649 individuals of the H haplogroup from 20 populations throughout Europe, Caucasus and the near East and, by managing to trace the localisation of the different sub-clades, were able to further resolve the evolutionary (and migrational) history of haplogroup H and modern Europeans.

In fact, it is believed that haplogroup H evolved in the Near East around 28.000-30.000 years ago and spread throughout Europe 20.000 years ago. Although it was thought that some, or all, of the European population of this haplogroup have re-expanded throughout the continent from a European glacial refuge 15.000 years ago, this was not possible to be confirmed. Now Pereira, Richards, Goios, Macaulay, Amorim and colleagues’ work not only confirms that in fact the oldest lineage of H (called H*) was found in the near East and entered Europe during the peak of the last Ice Age, but also claims to have identified the glacial refuge in Europe from where humans re-expanded as Iberia.

Pereira, Richards, Goios, Macaulay, Amorim and colleagues’ work is important for the history of human evolution suggesting that most modern Europeans evolved from hunter-gathers that expanded at the end of the last Ice Age (end of the Palaeolithic) from a glacial refuge in Iberia where they have stayed for around 10,000 years after an initial migration from the Near East.

Original paper’s authors:
Vincent Macaulay - vincent@stats.gla.ac.uk
Luísa Pereira -lpereira@ipatimup.pt
António Amorim - aamorim@ipatimup.pt
*
Reference URL
http://www.genome.org/cgi/content/abstract/15/1/19?ct

Keywords:
Life Sciences, History

Peer reviewed publication and references:
Genome Research (2005); Vol. 15, pp. 19-24
“High-resolution mtDNA evidence for the late-glacial resettlement of Europe from an Iberian refugium”.


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Dale Hoogeveen
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« Reply #1 on: January 12, 2005, 06:19:52 PM »

A "grand scenario" indeed.  Since neither the unpaired portion of the Y chromosome nor mtDNA can sample contributions of any other genetics, this is pretty wild;  so neither can even sample whether ancestry with differing strains of its own type no longer present was associated with the contribution of any of the other genetics.  

Neither can even provide a complete picture of the history of its own type.  Both, by their nature of reproduction, produce surviving lineages that are incomplete historical records and that are not suitable to extrapolation, since they do not produce proportionality in offspring populations.  The vast majority of the ancestry of both types goes unsampled and cannot be estimated from the surviving types of either type of genetics, since traces are not retained in either case.  All other ancestral contribution from ancestry having differing strains of either type is completely transparent.  All other extant genetics including the paired portions of the Y chromosome which are subject to crossover can literally come from anywhere for all that sampling of the surviving mtDNA and unpaired portion of Y are able to show.

Dale
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Dale Hoogeveen
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« Reply #2 on: January 13, 2005, 12:42:48 AM »


 Jacques,
 A post glacial expansion out of southern France and the Iberian Peninsula sounds logical,but details are sparse.Would you care to elborate on your reconstruction?
Bob
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Daryl Habel
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« Reply #3 on: January 13, 2005, 05:25:15 PM »


 Jacques,
 A post glacial expansion out of southern France and the Iberian Peninsula sounds logical,but details are sparse.Would you care to elborate on your reconstruction?
Bob

Dear All,

LGM refugia in southern Europe (with largest population densities in Franco-Cantabria) and post-glacial expansion northward is not only logical but, from my previous understanding (or mis-understanding?), generally thought to be a prehistorical occurrence.  Magdalenians, for instance, seem to originate earlier in Franco-Cantabria than in northern Europe, with the Cresswellian not appearing in Britain until ca. 13,000 BP.  Identification of a specific Iberian LGM refuge as the ancestral origin of most present-day Europeans (whether or not the authors are correct) is not difficult to reconcile with the above.  Of course, I have difficulty visualizing that all ancestors of northward-expanding post-LGM European populations originated from this Iberian refuge.  I'd also be interested in elaboration by Jacques, or comment from others, on perceived lack of inter-disciplinary reconciliation shown in the conclusion made by this paper.

Dar  
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Dale Hoogeveen
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« Reply #4 on: January 14, 2005, 02:41:22 PM »

Hi Dar,

all ancestors cannot be sampled from mtDNA.  

A trace running through intact mother/daughter strings can demonstrated by it, however.  While that is very significant, surviving mtDNA cannot show contributions from other sources, not even from the vast majority of female ancestry which does not come through intact mother/daughter strings.  

mtDNA only identifies a single trace route providing an absolute minimal sample of maternal ancestry with no markers for other genetics nor even for other contributing maternal ancestry either.

It is not quantifiable, but only traceable, since it shows nothing at all but an absolute minimal per generation survival only of particular mtDNA lineages.

The widespread natural presence of successful inter-specific and inter-generic hybridization actually suggests that mtDNA is not even species specific or that would automatically fail.  Tracing other genetics through mtDNA lineage survival  would not identify sources of those genetics;  since it appears to be quite generally compatible with a variety of sources of chromosomal genetics, a variety that transcends species boundries in a very large number of cases.

Dale


Dear All,

LGM refugia in southern Europe (with largest population densities in Franco-Cantabria) and post-glacial expansion northward is not only logical but, from my previous understanding (or mis-understanding?), generally thought to be a prehistorical occurrence.  Magdalenians, for instance, seem to originate earlier in Franco-Cantabria than in northern Europe, with the Cresswellian not appearing in Britain until ca. 13,000 BP.  Identification of a specific Iberian LGM refuge as the ancestral origin of most present-day Europeans (whether or not the authors are correct) is not difficult to reconcile with the above.  Of course, I have difficulty visualizing that all ancestors of northward-expanding post-LGM European populations originated from this Iberian refuge.  I'd also be interested in elaboration by Jacques, or comment from others, on perceived lack of inter-disciplinary reconciliation shown in the conclusion made by this paper.

Dar  
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Dale Hoogeveen
Jacques Cinq-Mars
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« Reply #5 on: January 19, 2005, 10:51:27 PM »

All,

Just a note to let you know that a “blog” called “Genetic Chaos” (!) gives you access to a large number of papers dealing with or dedicated to [the use of] “genetic research to study human migration patterns.”

It does have the Pereira & al. paper that was used to begin the present thread and also lists the following:

- A Signal, from Human mtDNA, of Postglacial Recolon...
-  Y chromosomal DNA variation in east Asian populati...
-  Mitochondrial DNA Studies of Native Americans: Con...
- High-Resolution Analysis of Human Y-Chromosome Var...
- Y chromosomal heritage of Croatian population and ...
- Differential Distribution of Allelic Variants in C...
- The Making of the African mtDNA Landscape100,000 y...
- Extensive Female-Mediated Gene Flow from Sub-Sahar...
- Y chromosome haplotypes reveal prehistorical migra...
- Different Genetic Components in the Ethiopian Popu...

… and much more.

The site can be found HERE.

Enjoy,

Jacques Cinq-Mars



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Daryl Habel
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« Reply #6 on: January 20, 2005, 04:01:37 AM »

Jacques,

"Genetic chaos" indeed.   I've been looking for access to the Pereira et al. article.  Comment (if any) will have to wait until the findings have been digested (however long that takes!).
Thanks for finding and posting this.
   
Dar
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Daryl Habel
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Jacques Cinq-Mars
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« Reply #7 on: January 20, 2005, 10:32:44 AM »

Jacques,

"Genetic chaos" indeed.   I've been looking for access to the Pereira et al. article.  Comment (if any) will have to wait until the findings have been digested (however long that takes!).
Thanks for finding and posting this.
   
Dar

Dar,

You're certainly welcome. Since quite a lot of recent articles -- such as the Pereira & al. one -- have developed the curious habit of popping up very rapidly and, sometimes, in more or less obscure webplaces, it does pay off to to ask for them. As you know, the policy of the Forum has been not to practice what I have called "soft piracy" of copyrighted material, but once a need for a specific paper has been identified and said paper is known by someone to be available, somewhere, it, admittedly, becomes pretty difficult to avoid making use ofperfectly reasonable offline bypasses!

Jacques
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caldararo
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« Reply #8 on: January 22, 2005, 04:41:54 PM »


    I think the Pereira, et al. article is also logical, though I have not had luck in accessing it from the blog.  Still the idea is perhaps only partially corrrect.  J.M. Coles and E.S. Higgs in their The Archaeology of Early Man, 1969, presented a comprehensive analysis of osteological materials, tool types and occupation sites throughout the Pleistocene and the Upper Paleo.  The complex picture which results is charted to geological evidence and climatological changes showing evidence of both migration, contact and diffusion and seasonal movements.  All these produce a picture of homind evolution which is quite able to fit a uniformitarian view of Homo coming into being and adapting to various enviornments.  The important element is to look at the conditions in localities now and how resources are used and available.  The less elegant idea that gives abritrary identity to Neandertals, AMH from Africa and East Asian "Archaics/Homo erectus", for example, can often be explained in a simple fashion.  Where some Of of Africa students believed that they could see Neandertals in valleys and Hss on mountain tops becomes less distinct as one perceives seasonal activities instead of different people.  Coles and Higgs give a number of examples of this.  They also show that there was migration from North Africa from the Middle East into Europe via both Spain and across the Mediterranean.  But of course, no one reads anything older than 10 years any more so we have to constantly reinvent the wheel except that people are so ideologically dogmatic now that their students read litle but their own side.
     On the other hand, Out of Africa types (with the exception of Paabo who presented a very different picture of the mtDNA and Y chromosome data in his San Francisco talk two years ago) continue to look at the genetic data as if humans were not a widespread species with hybridization histories like wolves.

The recent program "Neandertals on Trial" was the best in being more balanced.  Dibble's comments were clear and concise.

Niccolo Caldararo
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