New prehistoric decorated cave in Vilhonneur (France)

[trehinp]

An interesting discovery was announced in Vilhonneur, a place which was already known for the "Grotte du Placard".

The new decorated cave contains paintings and printed hands. The preliminary dating 25,000 BP, if confirmed, would make it an extremely important discovery.

In the same cave human fossils have been found. I've found only one article in a local news paper "La Charente Libre". The information is very limited. The picture doesn't show any of the art nor of the bones.

Click here for more

I'm impatient to see a more technical paper on that subject. Let's hope the final analysis keeps up to the promisses of the journalistic presentation...

Paul Trehin

[Jacques Cinq-Mars]

Dear Paul,

Thanks for picking this up and passing it on. It all sounds quite exciting and, like you, I will be waiting for further and more detailed “news” with impatience. I must say that, given the apparent importance of the discovery, I am intrigued by the lack of more substantial information. Usually, words about “finds” of type tend to seep out rather quickly. Perhaps this apparent secretiveness and silence/embargo is due to an increased application -- on the part of the “Culture” people -- of the “principe de précaution”, in order to avoid the kinds of controversies that developed, for example, in the wake of the Cosquer and Chauvet discoveries.

Regards,

Jacques

[trehinp]

Dear Paul,

Thanks for picking this up and passing it on. It all sounds quite exciting and, like you, I will be waiting for further and more detailed “news” with impatience. I must say that, given the apparent importance of the discovery, I am intrigued by the lack of more substantial information. Usually, words about “finds” of type tend to seep out rather quickly. Perhaps this apparent secretiveness and silence/embargo is due to an increased application -- on the part of the “Culture” people -- of the “principe de précaution”, in order to avoid the kinds of controversies that developed, for example, in the wake of the Cosquer and Chauvet discoveries.

Regards,

Jacques

You are right Jacques,

For once, the authorities have been conscious of the risks of a publication before the site was somewhat protected against intruders.

Here is another article (basically the same text, but this web page provides an automatic translation in English. "Not perfect " is an euphemism, but it is better than nothing... Click here to access this other article.

For an approximative English translation: Click here

But here again, the desire for sensationnal newsmaking lead the journalist to declare that these parietal paintings, possibly dated 25K BP, were revolutionising the prehistoric art knowledge, speaking of the earliest known parietal art, just forgetting the existence of Chauvet Cave paintings...

Still no pictures available unforunately...

Paul

[Jacques Cinq-Mars]

Paul,

Thanks for this additional information.

Here is (below) an English take on what is slowly trickling out of the Vilhonneur (?) cave. For all I know, the BBC piece is “derived” from the Nouvel Observateur story you just brought up. It does sounds interesting, but certainly hyped up by an over-enthusiastic mayor and some very mediocre journalism.

Jacques

French caver makes historic find
A French caver has discovered prehistoric cave art believed to date back 27,000 years - older than the famous Lascaux paintings.

BBC NEWS -- Published: 2006/02/06 16:35:47 GMT.

Gerard Jourdy, 63, said he found human and animal remains in the chamber in the Vilhonneur forest, in caves once used to dispose of animal carcasses.

The paintings included a hand in cobalt blue, he told AFP news agency.

The discovery was made in November, but kept secret while initial examinations were carried out.

Mr Jourdy also said he saw a sculpture of a face made from a stalactite - which would be a scientific first for the era, but experts were dubious about this claim, AFP says.

"In a small chamber I found the bones of two hyenas - complete skeletons, which is rare. And I saw human bones amid the debris - tibias, vertebrae and shoulder-blades," he told the news agency.

"Then in the bigger chamber there was this hand - very beautiful, very delicate. There was just the one in cobalt blue. When you come into the chamber it is like it is greeting you. It's incredible."

The French culture ministry confirmed the findings, but a spokesman said that although the discovery was of interest, the paintings were not as spectacular as those in the Cosquer and Chauvet caves in the Ardeche.

The Lascaux Caves, in the Dordogne, are among the best known and most important prehistoric sites of Stone Age cave art.

Experts think the caves were used for hunting rituals and shamanistic rites, and it is thought that the first paintings were done some 17,000 years ago.

Click HERE for access to the original article

[trehinp]

Some slightly more documented info about Vilhonneur Cave paintings, this time with some cautious words by Jean Clottes Click here for more

One interesting comment: if confirmed this cave would be among the rare palaeolithic caves combining a sanctuary and decorations : Romito cave in the region of Calabria (Italy ) and in the Cussac cave in Dordogne (France).

A similar commentary about the potential exceptional character of this finding is made in another French paper Click here. On this one the local archeaological representative authority also expresses some careful comments and suggests that one should be cautious before any scientific confirmation is provided.

Some scientific publications should indeed be made available in March.

I'll keep you posted...

Paul

[Daryl Habel]

In the same cave human fossils have been found. I've found only one article in a local news paper "La Charente Libre". The information is very limited. The picture doesn't show any of the art nor of the bones.

I haven't noticed anything new recently on the web about Vilhonneur, but expect a big announcement very soon.  While eating breakfast this morning, I was reading today's (June 3) Kokomo Tribune (my local newspaper) and stumbled upon the following.

Cave in western France contains rare finds

VILHONNEUR, France (AP) -- A 27,000-year-old human skeleton laid out in a room decorated with ancient art and a crude reporesentation of a face are among the rare finds in a cave in western France, officials said Friday.

The state took over ownership of the cave in the Vilhonneur forest on May 12, the French Culture Ministry said in the statement.

It was only the second time that a human body is known to have been placed in a decorated cave from the Upper Paleolithic Period, the ministry said.

It's likely the full AP report is longer, but science news is not my local newspaper's forte, and that's all that was printed.  Technically, being human paleontology, this is posted in the wrong forum board but, until further news on this skeleton, I decided this thread is appropriate.

Best,
Dar

 

[Jacques Cinq-Mars]

In the same cave human fossils have been found. I've found only one article in a local news paper "La Charente Libre". The information is very limited. The picture doesn't show any of the art nor of the bones.

I haven't noticed anything new recently on the web about Vilhonneur, but expect a big announcement very soon.  While eating breakfast this morning, I was reading today's (June 3) Kokomo Tribune (my local newspaper) and stumbled upon the following.

Cave in western France contains rare finds

VILHONNEUR, France (AP) -- A 27,000-year-old human skeleton laid out in a room decorated with ancient art and a crude reporesentation of a face are among the rare finds in a cave in western France, officials said Friday.

The state took over ownership of the cave in the Vilhonneur forest on May 12, the French Culture Ministry said in the statement.

It was only the second time that a human body is known to have been placed in a decorated cave from the Upper Paleolithic Period, the ministry said.

It's likely the full AP report is longer, but science news is not my local newspaper's forte, and that's all that was printed.  Technically, being human paleontology, this is posted in the wrong forum board but, until further news on this skeleton, I decided this thread is appropriate.

Best,
Dar

Dar,

Thanks for bringing this up and bravo to the  Kokomo Tribune!

I spent some time looking up the source of this recent release, and here is what I found. It seems to be derived from the recent formal announcement (last Friday) that the cave site had been acquired by the French government.

Here is the lengthier AP report on what has happened:

Ancient cave in western France contains rare finds
By PIERRE SAUVEY - Associated Press Writer - 06/03/06

VILHONNEUR, France — A 27,000-year-old human skeleton laid out in a room decorated with ancient art and a crude representation of a face are among the rare finds in a cave in western France, officials said Friday.

The state took over ownership of the cave in the Vilhonneur forest on May 12, the French Culture Ministry said in a statement.

It was only the second time that a human body is known to have been placed in a decorated cave from the Upper Paleolithic Period, the ministry said. [Reference is made to Cussac Cave – click HERE]

A single face drawn in the cave could be among the world’s oldest known graphic representations of a human face, said Jean-Yves Baratin, archaeology curator for the Poitou-Charentes region.

The face is ‘‘represented in the most elementary way,’’ Baratin said.

He said two pieces of calcite that split were used to form the hair with two black horizontal strokes depicting the eyes. A vertical stroke formed the nose and another horizontal stroke the mouth.

Cavers exploring part of a grotto once used to dispose of animal carcasses discovered the cave in December. The find was announced in February but it was not until Friday that information about what it contained was disclosed.

The famed Lascaux Cave in Montignac, in the southwest Dordogne region, has long been considered one of the finest examples of cave paintings. However, that art dates to 13,000 years, making the Vilhonneur art much older. Another cave, Chauvet, discovered in the mid-1990s in southeast France, features some 300 examples of Paleolithic animal art, some dating back 31,000 years.

Baratin underscored the significance of the human skeleton, a young male, placed inside a decorated room. He said two rib bones were analyzed at a Miami laboratory [presumably Beta Analytic], dating the skeleton at 27,000 years.

Click HERE for the original article.

More information (in French) containing thumbnails of the “Face?”, the “Hand”, the coloured “Dots”, and a human tibia can be accessed by clicking HERE.

Jacques

[trehinp]

Dar,

Thanks for bringing this up and bravo to the  Kokomo Tribune!

I spent some time looking up the source of this recent release, and here is what I found. It seems to be derived from the recent formal announcement (last Friday) that the cave site had been acquired by the French government.

Jacques

Thanks for the links Jacques,

there was a short video report on FR3 Channel in France. As usual rather disapointing. From the strict stand point of palaeolithic art, this cave seem to have revealed a lot less than the begining of the year hype was promissing...

I was however very interested by the very sophisticated use of the stone concretions to represent the hair on the head symbolic representation. The face is however very sketchy: just a few strokes of dark to figure the eyes, the nose and the lips. The use of "imbeded" figures is indeed one fascinating caracteristics of palaeolithic art. But in this case the "natural art" part seems exceptionally beautifully representative of the human hair.

Towards the end of the video, the commentator said that there were more galeries to be explored. Let's hope that some other pariatal art will be uncovered.

We will also have to wait for the official publicatoins.

Yours sincerely.

Paul

[Daryl Habel]

there was a short video report on FR3 Channel in France. As usual rather disapointing. From the strict stand point of palaeolithic art, this cave seem to have revealed a lot less than the begining of the year hype was promissing...

I was however very interested by the very sophisticated use of the stone concretions to represent the hair on the head symbolic representation. The face is however very sketchy: just a few strokes of dark to figure the eyes, the nose and the lips. The use of "imbeded" figures is indeed one fascinating caracteristics of palaeolithic art. But in this case the "natural art" part seems exceptionally beautifully representative of the human hair.

Towards the end of the video, the commentator said that there were more galeries to be explored. Let's hope that some other pariatal art will be uncovered.

We will also have to wait for the official publicatoins.

Yours sincerely.

Paul

Paul, et al.,

Here's a news item I picked off David Meadows' Explorator newsletter this morning:
CLICK HERE

Old masters

Archaeologists have discovered what they believe to be a 27,000-year-old drawing of a face, which would make it the oldest in history. Like many other ancient portraits, it is reminiscent of the work of some of the great modern artists, writes Jonathan Jones - and speaks volumes about the way we see ourselves

Tuesday June 6, 2006
The Guardian

So the article was written by Jonathon Jones, a journalist who obviously has spent some time contemplating the origin and meaning of portrait art.  At least he's posed some  thoughts about why humans easily recognize the "face" in this story and knows a lot more about "art" in general than I do.  I won't quote the whole article, which is both long and interesting (with an excellent photo of the Vilhonneur "face"), but a few paragraphs found deep in the story:

This face was made by human beings whose lives were more animal-like than we can imagine, hunting and being hunted in a world of woolly mammoths, sabre-toothed tigers and the other animals who - up to now - have seemed to be the main characters in cave art. And yet the portrait shows they recognised the animal that was different, that could look back at you in a special way and mirror you (did they know the concept of a mirror? Presumably they noticed their reflections in water).
So familiar were these people with the emotional significance of the human face that they didn't need to fill in every detail as they did when they painted animals. It is, of course, ironic that an ancient image discovered in France so uncannily resembles the Parisian modernism of the 1920s - one visitor to the cave has said it reminded him of Modigliani; to me it resembles the way Picasso and Braque notated facial details in their synthetic cubist paintings; you might also think of Brancusi. Is this a bit fishy? Presumably not, because the bones and use of charcoal in the cave means its contents can be carbon-dated.

Why did the first artists draw like Picasso? It has to be because of their attitude to the face, to their own embodiment and that of the people they lived with - it has to be because of how they saw human beings specifically, because this is very different from the way they painted animals. Stone Age artists could paint with a verisimilitude that takes your breath away; the horse panel in the Chauvet cave, older than this drawing, is covered with acutely observed heads of aurochs (extinct relatives of cattle) and horses whose tufty manes are painted with a clarity Da Vinci would have admired. Why is the human face so much harder to decipher, so stylised?

Look at the other portraits on these pages, all made in prehistory or at history's dawn, and you start to guess why. The earliest human instinct was not to photograph the face, but to decorate it, to ennoble it.

Yesterday I stood at the top of a staircase in the British Museum, staring into a case, making contact - I suddenly felt - with a person who died nearly 10,000 years ago. The head from Jericho is both a portrait and an actual human head. After this person died, an artist took the skull, placed sea shells in its eye sockets, and built up a new face on it in lime plaster; other examples of this art have hair and moustaches painted on. The British Museum skull is disconcerting because it challenges all my preconceptions about what art is, what a portrait is.

At Vilhonneur, I see a face but it looks like the face of the Lion King.  Individually, we see what we see. Anyways, for a story from the Guardian reporters, it's very thought-provoking..

Dar

[trehinp]

Thanks Dar,

The article from the Gardian is making several hypothetical comments about the face drawing style which I find quite "risqué"...

I will wait untill a scientific paper is published to make more remarks about this cave.

Thanks again though. :-)

Paul

[Daryl Habel]

The article from the Gardian is making several hypothetical comments about the face drawing style which I find quite "risqué"...

I will wait untill a scientific paper is published to make more remarks about this cave.

"risqué"... ??  I'm not suggesting I agree with the Guardian author, only that I don't know enough to agree or disagree with anyone about questions of  "why?" for the presence or absence of  art (in general) and portrait art  (specifically).  I offered that the Vilhonneur "face" looked more like the Lion King (to me) only because so much of the media is hyping this as a "human face", which, perhaps it is, or perhaps (from a more skeptical point-of-view) it is a "face" but not necessarily "human".   

Regardless of which, I'm more interested in the archaeological context of the human skeleton found there.  So I'm as anxious as you concerning forthcoming publications in scientific journals.  Let us hope it won't take long for their appearance.
Regards,
Dar